(Note: The date on this post is intentional; it keeps this post pinned to the top. Thanks for asking!).

11/11/07 Update: Loose Change Final Cut has just been released and so we have not prepared a full debunking. Both James and I have many comments about the movie below and I started a thread over at JREF with some examples of mistakes in the film. Much of the rest of the information in this particular post concerns the earlier versions of Loose Change.

Because this blog is getting so much traffic from Google searches and referrals from various forums and Wikipedia, we decided to put one post up top to link to information our newest visitors are apparently looking for.

First, if you have not seen the film and want to watch it, be sure to watch Markyx's annotated version, which he very kindly named after this blog, Screw Loose Change. Markyx did a terrific job on this, and we strongly recommend watching this version rather than Dylan Avery's cut.

James has put together a list of major lies in Loose Change. Here's Part 1. Part 2. Part 3. Part 4.

I compiled three very easily refuted lies in the movie. I also showed three tricks and distortions that are used throughout the film.

A friend of the blog named Mark Roberts (aka Gravy at the JREF forums) compiled this amazing Viewer's Guide to Loose Change, (now HTML) which includes a complete transcript of the movie, pictures and links that refute many of the claims, and which highlights the changes between Version 1 and Version 2.

The hot new film in 9-11 Denial is called 9-11 Mysteries. One of our JREF buddies, The Doc, has put together a rebuttal video called (you guessed it!) Screw 9-11 Mysteries, and assembled a viewers' guide to 9-11 Mysteries.

Many 9-11 Deniers focus on the collapse of World Trade Center 7, which fell at 5:20 PM on September 11, almost seven hours after the North Tower. I have devoted a fair amount of research to the topic of WTC 7. If you want a really detailed analysis of WTC 7, I recommend Mark Robert's WTC 7 and the Lies of the 9/11 Truth Movement.

If you'd like to discuss the ideas about 9-11 you've encountered here or elsewhere, another friend of the blog started a Screw Loose Change Forum. It's a very lively place with lots of opinion back and forth between both sides. There's also a Screw Loose Change MySpace page, with some animated commentary. Of course, we also welcome comments on our posts.

If you're looking for detailed rebuttals of other aspects of 9-11 Denial, I heartily recommend 9-11 Myths, Debunking 9-11 and Internet Detectives.

Markyx has also put together a video (note: graphic images and strong language) called 9-11 Deniers Speak. If you think Dylan Avery and Jim Fetzer have any respect for the victims of 9-11, just watch this film. There are five parts. Part II, Part III, Part IV, Part V.
There's also a Google Video which is all in one part.

This should be enough to get you started debunking Loose Change to your friends. We have a lot more content below this post.

Notes on unusual terms/abbreviations: Looser (not a misspelling of Loser)=Believer in Loose Change. CT=Conspiracy Theory, Conspiracy Theorist. Truther=9-11 Conspiracy Theorist (all Loosers are Truthers, not all Truthers are Loosers). OS=Official Story. CD= Controlled Demoliton. LIHOP: Let It Happen On Purpose; theory that the government knew the 9-11 attacks were coming but allowed them to happen to further other goals of theirs. MIHOP: Made It Happen On Purpose; theory that the government planned and orchestrated the attacks. Most Truthers are MIHOP.

Update: Comments closed on this post, which is intended solely as a pointer. Because Haloscan will not let us close comments on a particular post, be forewarned: Don't leave a comment in this post or it will be deleted.

Update II: Note on comments: We maintain open comments on this blog, and so you will see lots of posts from people dissenting with our viewpoint on 9-11. We trust our readers to separate the good arguments from the bad arguments and come to their own conclusions. Links that you see in the comments are of course not endorsed by either James or Pat, and you should approach any link in the comments (as you should approach any link from the blog) with a healthy degree of skepticism.

Charges related to alleged abuse of prisoners in federal detention centers

By CHRISTOPHER SHERMAN
Associated Press
Nov. 18, 2008, 7:37PM

McALLEN — A South Texas grand jury has indicted Vice President Dick Cheney and former Attorney General Alberto Gonzales on state charges related to the alleged abuse of prisoners in Willacy County's federal detention centers.

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/front/6119459.html

Bob Bowman, who mysteriously didn't run for president this year, now writes an open letter to Barack Obama, explaining to him the "truth". Unfortunately for him, I think he is about as welcome as a potential advisor as Bill Ayers. Regardless, he repeats his bizarre truther spin on economics, the first part of which I covered a long time ago, now adding a new twist.

Productivity in this country has doubled over and over again since the 1950s. Yet wages are a fraction of what they were then! In real terms, family income is about where it was in the 1950s, but the number of hours worked per family has tripled! This means that real wages per hour worked are roughly a third of what they were in the 1950s. If workers today got the same portion of the wealth they create with their labor as we did who entered the work force in the 1950s, they could support their families with one job … working two days a week!

This claim is completely bizarre of course, they have no more an understanding of economics than they do of engineering. The number of hours per week worked has actually come down significantly over the last 100 years, peaking during WWII for obvious reasons, but about even since the 1950s. Yes, more women work, the number has moved from around 20% to 60%, but the number of men working has actually decreased as a percentage. Additionally the size of the average household has decreased, so the number of hours worked per capita would have to increase even more. So unless there is some hidden surge in child labor, amounting to about 150% of the adult working population, that we don't know about, Bishop Bob is just making this crap up.

For "financing" Loose Change? As you may know, Cuban has been served with a civil complaint by the SEC alleging that he engaged in insider trading. However, according to a New York Times blog (it must be true!), one of the lawyers for the SEC noted Cuban's proposed financing of Loose Change Final Cut:

Mark:
If this upsets you, I wonder how George Bush feels. I assume that Mr. Cox would view your involvement with “Loose Change” much as I do. After all, he served his country as a Republican Congressman from Orange County for nearly 20 years and was appointed by President Bush. If you feel like sharing my thoughts with Chairman Cox, be my guest.

The time frame fits, although the NY Times' blogger apparently is unaware that Cuban did not end up financing the film (or distributing it, which I believe was the deal being discussed at the time). Note also the way he describes the film:

This e-mail message seems to have been sent after an exchange in which Mr. Norris complained that Mr. Cuban had financed a movie called “Loose Change” that discusses the president’s actions relating to Sept. 11.

Yeah, and Fahrenheit 9-11 discusses kite-flying in Iraq.

"The more details emerge, the clearer it becomes that Washington's handling of the Wall Street bailout is not merely incompetent. It is borderline criminal." - Naomi Klein, "In Praise of a Rocky Transition"

Klein talked about the Wall St. bailout on DemocracyNow! yesterday;

Part 1/3

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(See also Juan Cole's report on the "no-hunt" story: http://www.juancole.com/2008/11/afghan-article-says-us-bin-ladin-hunt.ht... -rep.)

Cannonfire.blogspot.com is a popular "liberal" blogger who is now buying into a "conspiracy theory";

"I do feel certain, or at least persuaded, that the American people were never told the full truth about what happened at Tora Bora."

This is someone who, in a links list titled "The Real 9/11 Truth Movement", links to Debunking911.com to "debunk" demolition theories- and in the same links list, links (several times) to articles at http://www.911Review.com that debunk the "no 757 at the Pentagon" and other disinformation. Strange disconnect, as 911Review.com also debunks the disinformation that plane damage, jet-fueled office fires and building mass turned the WTC towers into rapidly inflating dust clouds and small piles of rubble.

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Click Here

Topics:
1. Are there unanswered questions?
2. Was the 9/11 Commission a legitimate investigation?

Moderators:
Eric Jackman
Justin Martell

The show's name is "The Dynamic Duo", and it's a TV show. It will be taped on Monday, and put up shortly after.

Well, after celebrating their oil rig engineer and their golf course engineer, now they've picked up a swimming pool engineer. Or, rather, a guy who used to be a swimming pool engineer until his license to be a Professional Engineer was revoked by the State of New Jersey.

Donald C. Meserlian is the latest nut in the Blue Diamond warehouse that is A & E 9-11 Troof and even by their high standards he merits a rubber room all his own.

He is using the "Oath of Office" that all officials take: "To uphold and defend the U.S. and state Constitutions," and the Wikepedia definition of "Oath of Office" to charge all officials who do not respond to the petition with treason. If North Caldwell continues to disregard his first amendmendment (sic) "Right to Petition" and its inherent "Obligation to Respond" he plans to prosecute the mayor, council and police chief of N. Caldwell for treason.

Yep, he's planning on using the Wikipedia definition of Oath of Office to charge his local officials with treason. I am quite certain that their conviction and death by firing squad are mere formalities at this point.

He points to the seismic evidence in his statement joining Box Boy Gage's gaggle:

Seismographic evidence proved pre-planted explosives destroyed WTC 1, 2 and building 7 before the planes struck buildings 1 & 2.

9-11 Myths has devoted quite a bit of effort to determining the precise times of impact, and Mike's conclusion is that the seismic jolts recorded are indeed the impacts of the planes into the towers.

Here he introduces a crowd to Richard Gage's Blueprint for Destruction movie:



As you can see, he claims to be a forensic engineer; "This is what I do." Of course, that will be news to the owner of Monarch Pools and Spas, who writes:

I have personally dealt with Don Meserlian for over 25 years.

We have used his engineering services for everything from scaling our swimming pool blueprints to speaking with town inspectors to physically inspecting sites and providing written reports to topographical surveys.

Of course, that didn't work out terribly well; Meserlian was forced to surrender his engineering license by the State of New Jersey because he wasn't using a licensed surveyor in his work.

True to form, Meserlian is not just a crank about 9-11; he spreads his nuttery around. He's a believer in RFK Jr's theory that vaccines cause autism and is also a crusader against aspartame.

He's also got a blueprint for the world:

"Humanistic Capitalism" requires that both manufacturers and governments be accountable and responsible for the effects of their products and actions on the health and safety of people and the environment. Democratic governments, as representatives of people and stewards of the environment, must insure that "Humanistic Capitalism" replaces capitalism. All present so-called democracies are in fact 'demockeries' which only represent powerful special interests at the expense of their citizens (see below for the definition of demockery). To use capitalism's 'bottom-line', governments and corporations are being forced by VOSI to obey the US National Standards Strategy (USNSS) and the National Technology Transfer and Advancement Act of 1995 (NTTAA) and use standards which benefit the health and safety of people and the environment.

And if they don't he'll probably use the Wikipedia definition of democracy to prosecute them for treason.

Thanks to Jon Gold for sending me this ...

http://blog.spout.com/2008/11/18/mark-cuban-sec-charges-related-to-911-m...

A strange twist in the Mark Cuban story tonight, one which pushes it a little bit further into our wheelhouse. New York Times blogger Floyd Norris has published an email allegedly sent on May 05, 2007 to Cuban by Fort Worth SEC lawyer Jeffrey Norris (”no known relation to me”, notes the blogging Norris). In the email, Jeffrey Norris essentially tells on Cuban to SEC Chairman Christopher Cox, who is CCed, regarding Cuban’s involvement with Loose Change, a 9/11 conspiracy theory film which appeared online in three different incarnations over three years, becoming an internet sensation.

Addressing Cox, Norris explains that Cuban “participated in distributing the vicious and absurd documentary” and declares that Cuban’s “support for this project is irresponsible and immoral.” Floyd Norris posits that the email may be evidence that Cuban is “the victim of a political hit job because he helped finance a movie that was scathingly critical of President Bush.”

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http://rawstory.com/news/2008/Obama_admin_wont_prosecure_Bush_war_1117.h...
Stephen C. Webster
Monday November 17, 2008

Even as President-elect Obama vowed "to regain America's moral stature in the world" during Sunday's 60 Minutes appearance, two of his senior advisers confessed there is no intent to pursue those in the Bush administration who engaged in torture, a war crime.

Speaking on condition of anonymity to the Associated Press, the advisers said that the plan is to put a stop to current interrogation methods and to "look forward" as opposed to focusing on prior transgressions.

The Obama campaign did not offer a response before the report was published.

Human Rights Watch, a non-profit watchdog group, is lobbying the President-elect for fast action on the abuses of the Bush era.

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Scientific impossibility: Did FBI get their man in Bruce Ivins?
By Deborah Rudacille
Examiner Correspondent 11/16/08

Bruce Ivins was a cold-blooded murderer, a deranged psycho-killer, who in the fall of 2001, cooked up a virulent batch of powdered anthrax, drove to Princeton, N.J., and mailed letters loaded with the lethal mix to five news organizations and two U.S. senators.

At least, that’s what the FBI says.

The letters infected 22 people, killing five, including two Maryland postal workers.

The sixth victim of the madness was Ivins himself, a 62-year-old biodefense researcher at the U.S. Army Medical Research Institute of Infectious Diseases, who committed suicide rather than face charges.

Case closed? Neatly wrapped up? Not so fast.

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A friend of mine sent me this video of Max Keiser, a fruitcake who has apparently appeared on many shows as a financial expert.



But get his comments at about 1:00 in:

"Remember, these bankers in New York are deranged. You know I was talking to several brokers working in the Twin Towers about two weeks prior to 9-11. And some of them had actually heard the rumors of planes into the Twin Towers, and that they were still speculating by buying puts on airline stocks. That's the mentality we're dealing with on the global banking stage right now."

That's very interesting information. I would suggest that if the 9-11 Troof Movement wanted to get to the bottom of things, they should contact Mr Keiser who certainly appears to have information that could be very valuable in proving that 9-11 was an inside job. Who were these brokers? Why did Mr Keiser not inform the authorities that he had heard of a plot to crash planes into the Twin Towers two weeks before it happened?

I publish this as a service to the 9-11 "Truth" Movement.

I need a list of all of the significant events/actions regarding the 9/11 Truth Movement. Here is what I've got from memory:

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Dear President Obama:

Here is the Change We Need … and You can Make. YES, YOU CAN!

(An open letter to our new President outlining the real changes this country needs.)

by Lt. Col. Robert M. Bowman, Ph.D., National Commander, “The Patriots”

First, we would like to congratulate you on your historic victory. You face incredible challenges. At the same time, you have the unprecedented opportunity to bring about changes we have needed for a long time. We know there are those who will advise you to go slowly and govern “from the center.” On the other hand, most real change in any administration gets done in the first 100 days – the “honeymoon” period. Seldom has a new President had the mandate for change that you have been given. And never in our history have we needed real change like we need it now. So please act resolutely, boldly, and quickly to bring about the changes you know this country is yearning for.

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A clip from the Nov. 14 episode of HBO's Real Time with Bill Maher.
Related: http://www.shockdoctrine.com

http://georgewashington2.blogspot.com/2008/11/iraqing-american-economy.h...

The American economy hasn't just been wrecked, its been Iraqed.

As Senator Inhofe said Saturday:

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Richard Gage Speaks Out: 9/11 Blueprint for Truth - the Architecture of Destruction
Richard Gage, founding member of Architects & Engineers for 9/11 Truth, explained to an audience of about 165 people in Louvain-La-Neuve (Belgium) that the official story is scientifically impossible.

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We did not have much time to do a long street action but we did what we could. We were outside city hall from 3:30 PM to about 5:00 PM and handed out quite a few dvds and talked to a few people about 9/11 truth. Great response from the public, no adverse comments. Keep an eye out on this blog for more info on our next street action December 11, 2008.
kitchener911truth.blogspot.com

Zinn of course wrote a cover blurb for David Ray Griffin's the New Pearl Harbor, in which he gushed:

"David Ray Griffin has done admirable and painstaking research in reviewing the mysteries surrounding the 9-11 attacks. It is the most persuasive argument I have seen for further investigation of the Bush administration's relationship to that historic and troubling event."
— Howard Zinn

But here he takes the (more) sensible approach that Monbiot and Chomsky have, that Trooferism is a distraction from the real work the Left has to do.

Buddy Moore, the Troofer asking the question, apparently ran for US Senate as a "Write-In" candidate; the Rocky Mountain News shows four candidates who received a significant number of votes in that election; Buddy Moore is not one of them.

My fellow Truthers,

I went to United for Peace and Justice meeting this afternoon here in Chicago. There were about 25 people in attendance. It was an organizing meeting on the upcoming UFPJ National Assembly coming up on December 12-14 here in Chicago.

During the brainstorming discussion on what kinds of things people were wanting to see materialize at the upcoming Assembly, one gentlemen said that the numbers within peace groups across the country are generally diminishing. I spoke up, and invited UFPJ to broaden their platform and embrace the Movement for 9/11 Truth and Accountability. I emphasized the fact that our numbers continue to grow, not only with grassroots activists but with military officials, scholars, architects, engineers, etc.

My comments seemed to fall on deaf ears. One other person commented, and spoke about his bleak 9/11 Truth seminar that he conducted last year at the UFPJ National Assembly. A few others came up to me after the meeting and told me they supported 9/11 Truth. It was as though they 'had to remain closet Truthers' because UFPJ has ostracized the 9/11 Truth Movement. No one else commented on my invitation/proposal.

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